User Disk Area Segment AC450 /AC410 / ES 100

Good afternoon , please Could you support to the following question?
customer has 1 AC450 M 2 AC410 , ES 100 Application builder 2.6 , Function Chart Builder 2.6 , Online Builder 2.6
we have verified User Disk Application Segment version from ES and controller , and the version number are the same through SHUDAS command r to every controller ( one AC410 version/ES100 are the same but negative number like -92916 ) also we verified the DIMPC command and we could see User Disk Application Area and it has defined memory in them , in this case because we have backup option activated we could use RUDAS or SUDAS command to update User Disk Application Segment from both sides , so we should not have any problem about unless negative number to be an issue , if we had any issue with different identifiers ( controller / ES ) , should we fix the difference issue from reliable side doing for example RUDAS command and then we would continue configuration task , I mean , first we should fix it then we could continue our work , ?
It is an old system we have already suggested to the customer to do upgrade to 800xA 6.0/3 and also , ES station and they are thinking to do that , it may be one year later .

Thanks for your support

Best Regards

Ricardo

User Disk Area Segme.docx

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ricardo.marrero.a Rank: 158

Asked 1 year ago

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Hello Ricardo,
If your customer have been using just one single ES100 for online changes within the whole system life time, you should not worry about Backup user area versions, because segments in ES100 hardrive are used during programming in Online builder but not Backup user disk areas in PLCs.
Note that any AS500 operator station may also be used for online changes hence User segments might be already messed up.
The aim of Backup user area in AC410/AC410 is just transfer the last version of user segments between egineering stations ES100 or AS500.

If possibly more than one online builder has been used for online changes than you should fix User disk area versions prior to any online activity.
Check if Online builder shows correct symbol names randomly across all PC programs.
If Symbol names are messed up you can fix the issue by deleting PC programs and TRPCS to all pc programs in affected PLC. In that case you must be sure all AA files are up to date , I mean AA files contain all recent online changes.
Please consider using my conversion tool Ampl2m for future system migration, it works reliable.
I hope it helps, Kamil

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kamil.herman Rank: 23

Answered 1 year ago

Hello Ricardo.

I see that you use the feature to backup the user disk segment in the AC450, SUDAS or it actually happens automatically now days when you type TSESS after online modifications.

Anyhow the controller with a negative number on the user disk may have a corrupted userdisk or a memory corruption.
I suggest that you take new PC and DB source code backups, DUPCS and DUDBS, if you succeed the application program is OK.

Then I recommend you to reload this controller from the beginning with DIMDB DIMPC and TRDBS plus TRPCS to create a new useer disk segment and save that segment in the controller.
Remember to delete the existing PC mass files in the USER folder before you start to load the DB and PC source code again.

Best Regards
Jan-Erik

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by ricardo.marrero.a Rank: 158 on 9/13/2019 6:46:26 AM | Like (0) | Report

Hello Jan-Erik, thanks for your response, did you see the attachment that I sent.

Regards

Ricardo

by ricardo.marrero.a Rank: 158 on 9/14/2019 8:20:29 AM | Like (0) | Report

Hi Jan , we have executed the DIMPC Command we have seen the following :Free space in system 229 kb , Allocated PC area 1000 kb, Available PC area 698 kb, Allocated interpreter area 1000 kb, Size of PC pgm tables 1000 kb , interpreter A 100 , Interpreter B 150 , Interpreter C 200. From command DIMDB we could see at the top of the window Free Space in system 229 kb, Allocated data base area 440kb , Spare Area in data base 100 kb. we have written all this information
what do you think about the current dimensioning , we have seen it without any warning .
Havind said it , please if you can read this procedure to know your opinion about that :
1- DUMPDBS
2-DUMPPCS
3-From SLLEV SYST , DELETE USER:PCMASS*.*, keeping the *TI,*TC,*TB ( function chart builder type circuits.
4- execute reconfiguration command , we delete PC Programs and DB elements., clear the content of the control module.
5- Execute TRDBS , when it askes about redimensioning , Y , but the question is , if the dimensioning procedures has been done properly according to the information that I wrote above which t is fine , why do we need to dimension again if the information is already configured?
6- Execute TRPCS , when it askes about redimensioning , Y , but the question is , if the dimensioning procedures has been done properly according to the information that I wrote above which t is fine , why do we need to dimension again if the information is already configured?
7- SLLEV command PC level , because PCMASS files are not in USER directory , CR to create it , then we did TSSES to save the user disk application segment to the AC410 Controller , then we should execute SHUDAS to see if the version does not show negative number.
if you have any comment about the procedure , please let us know before doing the procedures.
Another comment , Can the system work if the identifiers are differents? the question arises because the information mentions that the system could work despite of this issue.

Thanks for your support

Best Regards

Ricardo

by ricardo.marrero.a Rank: 158 on 9/14/2019 9:28:56 AM | Like (0) | Report

Hi Jan, We have 800xA version 4.1 AC400 Connect and Is there any problem with TTD LOg , if we do that ?

Regards

Ricardo

by ricardo.marrero.a Rank: 158 on 9/15/2019 5:28:42 PM | Like (0) | Report

Hi Jan , Another question about initialization of User Disk Application Segment , you have mentioned delete PCMASS files , manual 3BSE002417R601 AMPL Reference manual page 145 , it shows , the content of user disk application segment PCMASS.SM, PCMASS*.AP, P1PCMASS.NI , USERID.UI ,*TI , *TB , *TC
To initialize User Disk Application Segment after reconfig ( erase application) , the manual in page 148 , it shows : delete PCMASS.SM , PCMASS*.AP and *.UI , but the *.UI is USERID.UI , manual does not show to erase P1PCMASS.NI eventhough it is a PCMASS file also ,
Please , could you clarify it ?

Thanks for your support
Best Regards

Ricardo

by Jan-Erik Rask Rank: 80 on 9/15/2019 11:20:37 PM | Like (0) | Report

When loading via source code, *.AA and *.BA files you must always dimension the system before loading.
I do not recognize P1PCMASS.. You can delete all PCMASS* files in the USER folder as they will be re created during the source code load
YOu have 229Kb free space in system, You have reserved 1000 Kb for PC application and you are only using 302 kb of the 1000 kb

The questions regarding redimension does not appear when you load source code, only when you load table dumps, LOTDB and LOTPT, These commands will not work to defagment the system and to create new user segments. You must load source code.

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Jan-Erik Rask Rank: 80

Answered 1 year ago

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User Disk Area Segment AC450 /AC410 / ES 100

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